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	<title>Comments on: A Lesson For Justin Higgins</title>
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	<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins</link>
	<description>It's meat! And it thinks!</description>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10040</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 22:38:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10040</guid>
		<description>bq. I didn’t say sole owner, you idiot, I said they own it. 

Again: You make a claim, and present not a shred of evidence in support of it. 

bq. Stop dancing around the fact that the JEM is a terrorist group and Save Darfur doesn’t say that. 

That wasn&#039;t your claim, widdle boy:

bq. &lt;a href=&quot;#comment-10031&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE.&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;a href=&quot;http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAFR540892004&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Amnesty International has been reporting since at least July 2004 that the JEM is involved in the conflict&lt;/a&gt;.  AI also has reported on atrocities committed by JEM:

bq. The armed political groups, the Sudan Liberation Army (SLA) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), have also breached international humanitarian law, for instance, by sometimes sheltering among the civilian population and by reportedly unlawfully killing unarmed civilians. There have also been reports of torture by the JEM, in particular of a group of detainees who were said to have been bound with chains and beaten in September 2003; two of them allegedly had a mixture of chilli, acid and petrol forced into their mouths. They have also reportedly abducted members of Arab groups and there have been reported cases of rape by members of the armed groups against women in Arab villages. The armed political groups have also taken humanitarian workers as hostages for brief periods.

You got caught lying, Justin. 

bq. You’re a pig.

But I&#039;m a pig with the facts on my side. You&#039;re a pissed-off little liar with no facts to back up your claims.

bq. They didn’t report the JEM also slaughtering innocent people, did they? 

Yes, Justin, AI reported that very fact. I&#039;ve presented the facts to you twice now. You refuse to acknowledge them.

bq. You’re arguing semantics and you KNOW that I’m right. 

No, Justin. I am reporting the facts. Those facts contradict your assertions. I know that you are a liar. And you know it too.

bq. You’re a bullshit artist, and even if you do good work, it’s still shit.

I&#039;m not the one spreading lies, Justin. That&#039;s your gig.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>I didn’t say sole owner, you idiot, I said they own it. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Again: You make a claim, and present not a shred of evidence in support of it. </p>
<blockquote>
<p>Stop dancing around the fact that the JEM is a terrorist group and Save Darfur doesn’t say that. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>That wasn&#8217;t your claim, widdle boy:</p>
<blockquote>
<p><a href="#comment-10031" >Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE.</a></p>
</blockquote>
<p><a href="http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAFR540892004" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" >Amnesty International has been reporting since at least July 2004 that the JEM is involved in the conflict</a>.  AI also has reported on atrocities committed by JEM:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>The armed political groups, the Sudan Liberation Army (SLA) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), have also breached international humanitarian law, for instance, by sometimes sheltering among the civilian population and by reportedly unlawfully killing unarmed civilians. There have also been reports of torture by the JEM, in particular of a group of detainees who were said to have been bound with chains and beaten in September 2003; two of them allegedly had a mixture of chilli, acid and petrol forced into their mouths. They have also reportedly abducted members of Arab groups and there have been reported cases of rape by members of the armed groups against women in Arab villages. The armed political groups have also taken humanitarian workers as hostages for brief periods.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>You got caught lying, Justin. </p>
<blockquote>
<p>You’re a pig.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>But I&#8217;m a pig with the facts on my side. You&#8217;re a pissed-off little liar with no facts to back up your claims.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>They didn’t report the JEM also slaughtering innocent people, did they? </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Yes, Justin, AI reported that very fact. I&#8217;ve presented the facts to you twice now. You refuse to acknowledge them.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>You’re arguing semantics and you KNOW that I’m right. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>No, Justin. I am reporting the facts. Those facts contradict your assertions. I know that you are a liar. And you know it too.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>You’re a bullshit artist, and even if you do good work, it’s still shit.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;m not the one spreading lies, Justin. That&#8217;s your gig.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Justin Higgins</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10039</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Higgins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 22:08:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10039</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t say sole owner, you idiot, I said they own it. Stop dancing around the fact that the JEM is a terrorist group and Save Darfur doesn&#039;t say that. You CAN&#039;T! If you refuse to, you&#039;re indirectly perpetuating a watered-down version of a conflict which will only allow it to continue, with terrorists fighting on both sides. You&#039;re a pig. They didn&#039;t report the JEM also slaughtering innocent people, did they? You&#039;re arguing semantics and you KNOW that I&#039;m right. You&#039;re a bullshit artist, and even if you do good work, it&#039;s still shit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t say sole owner, you idiot, I said they own it. Stop dancing around the fact that the JEM is a terrorist group and Save Darfur doesn&#8217;t say that. You CAN&#8217;T! If you refuse to, you&#8217;re indirectly perpetuating a watered-down version of a conflict which will only allow it to continue, with terrorists fighting on both sides. You&#8217;re a pig. They didn&#8217;t report the JEM also slaughtering innocent people, did they? You&#8217;re arguing semantics and you KNOW that I&#8217;m right. You&#8217;re a bullshit artist, and even if you do good work, it&#8217;s still shit.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10038</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 21:04:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10038</guid>
		<description>Oh, really? I smell another fact-free unsupported assertion. Show me the paper trail that proves that Amnesty International is sole &quot;owner&quot; of the Save Darfur campaign. I&#039;ll wait. I won&#039;t even refer to you as an &quot;idiot&quot; if it turns out you can&#039;t provide this evidence.

Then you can explain why you ignored the evidence on AI&#039;s own site that they have done just what you claim they haven&#039;t: report the involvement of JEM in the Darfur conflict.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, really? I smell another fact-free unsupported assertion. Show me the paper trail that proves that Amnesty International is sole &#8220;owner&#8221; of the Save Darfur campaign. I&#8217;ll wait. I won&#8217;t even refer to you as an &#8220;idiot&#8221; if it turns out you can&#8217;t provide this evidence.</p>
<p>Then you can explain why you ignored the evidence on AI&#8217;s own site that they have done just what you claim they haven&#8217;t: report the involvement of JEM in the Darfur conflict.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Justin Higgins</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10037</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Higgins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 20:57:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10037</guid>
		<description>Amnesty International OWNS Save Darfur, idiot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amnesty International OWNS Save Darfur, idiot.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10036</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 20:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10036</guid>
		<description>&#039;Scuse me, bright boy: You were whining about *Amnesty International*. They do report atrocities committed by JEM. Do your homework, and quit trying to blame one organization for what some other organization does or does not report. It&#039;s dishonest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;Scuse me, bright boy: You were whining about <strong>Amnesty International</strong>. They do report atrocities committed by JEM. Do your homework, and quit trying to blame one organization for what some other organization does or does not report. It&#8217;s dishonest.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Justin Higgins</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10035</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Higgins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 20:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10035</guid>
		<description>Read from the Save Darfur site, and &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.savedarfur.org/pages/background&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;you&#039;ll see&lt;/a&gt; that the Janjaweed are being painted as the only villains. That&#039;s what I meant by not explaining who they&#039;re fighting. Look how they cast the JEM:

&lt;blockquote&gt;After decades of neglect, drought, oppression and small-scale conflicts in Darfur, two rebel groups - the Sudanese Liberation Army/Movement (SLA/M) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM) - mounted a challenge to Sudan&#039;s president, Omar al-Bashir. These groups represent agrarian farmers who are mostly non-Arab black African Muslims from a number of different tribes. President al-Bashir&#039;s response was brutal.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Where is the mention of the terrorist ties within the JEM and the fact that both them and the SLA are massacring people to? THAT is what my point is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Read from the Save Darfur site, and <a href="http://www.savedarfur.org/pages/background" >you&#8217;ll see</a> that the Janjaweed are being painted as the only villains. That&#8217;s what I meant by not explaining who they&#8217;re fighting. Look how they cast the JEM:</p>
<p>
<blockquote>After decades of neglect, drought, oppression and small-scale conflicts in Darfur, two rebel groups &#8211; the Sudanese Liberation Army/Movement (SLA/M) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM) &#8211; mounted a challenge to Sudan&#8217;s president, Omar al-Bashir. These groups represent agrarian farmers who are mostly non-Arab black African Muslims from a number of different tribes. President al-Bashir&#8217;s response was brutal.</p></blockquote>
<p>Where is the mention of the terrorist ties within the JEM and the fact that both them and the SLA are massacring people to? THAT is what my point is.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10034</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 20:33:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10034</guid>
		<description>bq. Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. 

Is it in fact true that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people? Yes or no?

bq. They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE.

You&#039;re lying again, Justin. &lt;a href=&quot;http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAFR540892004&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Amnesty International has been reporting since at least July 2004 that the JEM is involved in the conflict&lt;/a&gt;.  AI also has reported on atrocities committed by JEM:

bq. The armed political groups, the Sudan Liberation Army (SLA) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), have also breached international humanitarian law, for instance, by sometimes sheltering among the civilian population and by reportedly unlawfully killing unarmed civilians. There have also been reports of torture by the JEM, in particular of a group of detainees who were said to have been bound with chains and beaten in September 2003; two of them allegedly had a mixture of chilli, acid and petrol forced into their mouths. They have also reportedly abducted members of Arab groups and there have been reported cases of rape by members of the armed groups against women in Arab villages. The armed political groups have also taken humanitarian workers as hostages for brief periods.

&quot;Watered-down&quot; apparently is Justin-speak for &quot;they didn&#039;t send me a notice of what they reported printed on Day-Glo orange paper&quot;. And of course, we have yet to see &lt;strong&gt;one single crumb of evidence&lt;/strong&gt; to back up your claim that the AI coverage of the Darfur crisis is &quot;factually inaccurate&quot;.

It took me all of three minutes with Google to uncover the document I cited here. Is all your research this sloppy, O mighty unabashed conservative?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Is it in fact true that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people? Yes or no?</p>
<blockquote>
<p>They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>You&#8217;re lying again, Justin. <a href="http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAFR540892004" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" >Amnesty International has been reporting since at least July 2004 that the JEM is involved in the conflict</a>.  AI also has reported on atrocities committed by JEM:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>The armed political groups, the Sudan Liberation Army (SLA) and the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), have also breached international humanitarian law, for instance, by sometimes sheltering among the civilian population and by reportedly unlawfully killing unarmed civilians. There have also been reports of torture by the JEM, in particular of a group of detainees who were said to have been bound with chains and beaten in September 2003; two of them allegedly had a mixture of chilli, acid and petrol forced into their mouths. They have also reportedly abducted members of Arab groups and there have been reported cases of rape by members of the armed groups against women in Arab villages. The armed political groups have also taken humanitarian workers as hostages for brief periods.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>&#8220;Watered-down&#8221; apparently is Justin-speak for &#8220;they didn&#8217;t send me a notice of what they reported printed on Day-Glo orange paper&#8221;. And of course, we have yet to see <strong>one single crumb of evidence</strong> to back up your claim that the AI coverage of the Darfur crisis is &#8220;factually inaccurate&#8221;.</p>
<p>It took me all of three minutes with Google to uncover the document I cited here. Is all your research this sloppy, O mighty unabashed conservative?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Justin Higgins</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10031</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Higgins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 19:41:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10031</guid>
		<description>Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE. That is where the JEM enters the Amnesty story. By not showing that the other SIDE (JEM, al-Turabi) has terrorist ties too, they&#039;re not telling the full story, and instead putting out a watered down version of what&#039;s happening in Darfur.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amnesty International, in their own information, say that Janjaweed fighters are slaughtering people. They make no mention that the Janjaweed are fighting SOMEONE. That is where the JEM enters the Amnesty story. By not showing that the other SIDE (JEM, al-Turabi) has terrorist ties too, they&#8217;re not telling the full story, and instead putting out a watered down version of what&#8217;s happening in Darfur.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10030</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 19:36:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10030</guid>
		<description>bq. My supporting evidence is right in the article.

False. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that the Amnesty International account is either &quot;watered down&quot; or &quot;factually inaccurate&quot;. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign is in reality a “plot” to ensure “surrending [sic] in Iraq”. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that carpet bombing ”[t]he only thing we could be doing in Darfur that would help us”. Your claim that your article contains this evidence is a lie.

bq. It’s watered down because they’re not revealed the truth about groups like the JEM and the terrorists behind it.

What &quot;truth&quot;? You mentioned &quot;JEM&quot; in your article, but so what? How is JEM relevant to Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign?

bq. There’s an entire section on their side having a man who the 9/11 commission said wants to unite Sunni and Shia to fight Israel and the U.S.

Whose &quot;side&quot;? (Do you mean &quot;site&quot;? Say so.) What man? Are you referring to Hassan &#039;Abd Allah al-Turabi? What is his relevance to Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign?

Make an actual argument, Justin. Throwing out semi-random facts doesn&#039;t qualify.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>My supporting evidence is right in the article.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>False. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that the Amnesty International account is either &#8220;watered down&#8221; or &#8220;factually inaccurate&#8221;. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign is in reality a “plot” to ensure “surrending [sic] in Iraq”. You give no evidence whatsoever to support your claim that carpet bombing ”[t]he only thing we could be doing in Darfur that would help us”. Your claim that your article contains this evidence is a lie.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>It’s watered down because they’re not revealed the truth about groups like the JEM and the terrorists behind it.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>What &#8220;truth&#8221;? You mentioned &#8220;JEM&#8221; in your article, but so what? How is JEM relevant to Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign?</p>
<blockquote>
<p>There’s an entire section on their side having a man who the 9/11 commission said wants to unite Sunni and Shia to fight Israel and the U.S.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Whose &#8220;side&#8221;? (Do you mean &#8220;site&#8221;? Say so.) What man? Are you referring to Hassan &#8216;Abd Allah al-Turabi? What is his relevance to Amnesty International’s involvement in the Save Darfur campaign?</p>
<p>Make an actual argument, Justin. Throwing out semi-random facts doesn&#8217;t qualify.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Justin Higgins</title>
		<link>http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/comment-page-1#comment-10029</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Higgins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Jun 2007 19:24:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thinkingmeat.net/2007/06/18/a-lesson-for-justin-higgins/#comment-10029</guid>
		<description>My supporting evidence is right in the article. It&#039;s watered down because they&#039;re not revealed the truth about groups like the JEM and the terrorists behind it. There&#039;s an entire section on their side having a man who the 9/11 commission said wants to unite Sunni and Shia to fight Israel and the U.S. That&#039;s the watering down, that they don&#039;t say that. Done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My supporting evidence is right in the article. It&#8217;s watered down because they&#8217;re not revealed the truth about groups like the JEM and the terrorists behind it. There&#8217;s an entire section on their side having a man who the 9/11 commission said wants to unite Sunni and Shia to fight Israel and the U.S. That&#8217;s the watering down, that they don&#8217;t say that. Done.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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